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Sorry, I know we don't need another EV thread, but this didn't particularly fit in elsewhere, and it overlaps with another topic that has been sitting in my craw for a while.
Two issues kind of collided headlong for me, here. One is that I'm a big believer in standing behind your word. The waffling on verbal commitments has always been a problem for me. I know it's becoming a game, and almost expected, but for me, that only makes it worse because it's not a game, it's your word. When you say you're going to do something, you do it. If that's old school, I'm sorry. It's a value I've tried to impart as a parent. Once you put your word out there, you've established what should be a baseline for reliance, and people tend to count on it. We need that to make the world go round in an orderly fashion.
The other issue that's bothered me forever is the near adulation of adolescents that accompanies recruiting. Basically, these are young people who have been getting pampered and having their asses kissed since it was clear they were freakishly gifted. It has become a circus. My apologies to those who love it, and even make a living by it, but I feel that it gives a disproportionate amount of the wrong kind of attention to young people who are not always capable of handling it. But, that's just me. More old school stuff.
Where these two intersect is Eddie Vanderdoes. Now, I don't know the young man, and know very little about him. He may have many redeeming qualities, and even more importantly, may have very good and personal reasons for wanting to renege on his word. So, I am only working on assumptions, and I understand that word can often be driven by its first three letters. Be that as it may, I see someone who, for many years, reaped the benefits of the recruiting game, had ample time to make a decision, perhaps even longer than he took, if he wanted it, and was really only expected to do one thing -- put his name on a piece of paper and live up to its conditions.
This is not about how good he is, or what he means to Notre Dame. It's much bigger than the game of football. When someone rides the wave of recruiting and reaps the benefits of the ridiculous amount of notoriety that accompanies it, then you have to stick to the bargain at the other end. These are the rules of the game. You know it going in. You don't get to change them because you want to continue getting your way. Life doesn't work like that. There are costs and consequences to all decisions, particularly when they are legally binding acts. Absent compelling reasons otherwise, Eddie needs to honor his word. If he doesn't, then the biggest disappointment isn't that he isn't coming to Notre Dame, it's that he isn't Notre Dame material. I'd love to see him prove me wrong.
I may not be pretty, but I'm fast.....
POTW 1/31/11 - 2/6/11
POTW! Very well said! I agree 1,000,000%!
Gringo Mafia Director of Recruiting Analysis // POTW --> 5-16-11 / 5-30-11 / 3-5-12 / 12-30-12 / 2-24-13 / 9-1-13 / 9-22-13
I know that your comments apply not just to EV. But, specifically with respect to him,
I offer these thoughts(my one and one half cents worth):
1. Your comments assume that from the moment he signed his LOI until
now, nothing happened to lead him to change his mind;
2. However, there is "smoke" that there was some "rift" or misunderstanding
that lead to "damage", that lead to "much going back and forth" that
lead, in turn, to where we are;
3. There is also Lou's original comment that the issue was "one class"
that both sides were working on and it should be noted that the Vanderdoes
family only stated that there was no grade,eligibility, character,etc. problems
as to Placer High School and the NCAA---in other words, Notre Dame
is conspiculously absent in their comment, leaving the possibility open
that a ND academic issue may be out there, which then prompted
him to rethink distance,etc.
So, while your comments are "right on" if nothing occurred from
ND's side, the problem is that we are dealing with the "fog"
that so often envelops us when we try to put our arms around
what "really is going on."
So, while I agree totally with your comments, they might not
apply to EV and his situation.
POTY right here. I have had the privilege of meeting this man in person. God bless you Ham
5 Time POTW--Gringo Mafia Director of Guerrilla Warfare
awe a post of pure common sense how refreshing. i agree whole heartedly. my dad lived and died by his good word and instilled that in me early and often. this generation knows nothing if honoring your word. in this generation of entitlements kids feel they dont have to earn anything its given yo them without question. if he or any other kid wants to have his cake hed going to have to eat too. im tired of the games that r played!!!! have a good life cause away from notre dame nothing is greener on the other side. whew now i feel better having said that!!!!
Better then how I tried to word it. Very well said. I'll only eat one pound of bacon tomorrow instead of my usual 3.
2 time POTW winner on some dates I can't remember from 2yrs ago at BNG,
POTW: 1/3/11- 1/9/11, 6/20/11-6/26/11
Hemy, absolutely. That's why I tried to qualify my premise with the word "assumption." As Mr. Rice also pointed out, there is much that we don't know and that suggests withholding comment until we know more. And as you suggest, some of what we don't know may implicate Notre Dame in a way that makes Vanderdoes' position more understandable. But note that I said "absent compelling reasons otherwise," so I think I provided myself with some cover for the contingencies you suggest. Though I never practiced law, and would not have your familiarity with it, I can draw upon a hazy recollection of Contracts to know that rescission can be granted when there is some kind of breach, misrepresentation, etc. We don't know all the facts here, but my point was based on an absence of changed circumstances. As such, it is more hypothetical than real. It is simply a construct. When the facts are clear, we can plug them in, but I'll stand by the general points, independent of this situation. And if there are no changed circumstances which would grant him "relief," I'd cut him, or anyone else, no slack whatsoever.
Ham nails it again. If you don't have integrity you don't have anything in life.
Love your post Ham. An individuals word better count for something. If you can't live by that credo I have little time for you.
He was old enough, pampered enough and idolized. When it came time to sign he did so of free will. There is no way I can justify letting him walk on us without repercussions.
I wish his family could read your post.
Keeper of all Somogyi secrets and swell quotes.
That's a great post pal. I can't argue in the slightest about the value of one's word. However, I'm not sure that most kids are taught very well in the matter these days. Over 50% of kids grow up in homes that are the result of broken promises. Countless people today work in jobs and steal regularly from their employers as they spend on the clock time on personal diversions. Some parents I know actually lie for their kids when it's expedient, thus teaching kids that wonderful art for themselves. Then we have government, in which lying is virtual requirement for tenure. Most people believe that the rules of engagement in business are different than their personal lives; hence the saying, "It's not personal; it's just business." In short, I think it's really tough for most kids today to be well enough acquainted with honor to understand its value.
Personally, I feel kind of bad for kids who have responsibilities as great as these. You are right when you say that these kids have benefitted from the adulation they receive -- at least in certain, material ways. But, in a larger way, don't we do them a disservice by worshipping those things about them that are least importanat. Was Manti T'eo great because he could tackle, or because he was an honorable kid? A lot of these kids are pushed to the brink by their folks because their parents want to cash in on their talent. They're taught that their value lies in their talent rather than their character.
Like you, I have no idea what happened here. My objection to much of what has been posted lies in the sense of judgment to which many seem to feel entitled. I don't know how many times people are thrilled when a kid comes to Notre Dame after decomitting from another school, but infuriated when a different kid decommits from Notre Dame. Granted, a verbal commitment differs from a signed contract, but they both involve breaking one's word, and many posters who are remarkably righteous when the broken word goes against us rise in glee when it works our way. We justify it in any number of ways, none of which are even remotely justifiable.
Nonetheless, I agree with the entire tenor of your post. I long for the days when my dad would buy a car by calling the bank and telling them he'd stop in and sign papers when he had the chance. I miss the days when a handshake could seal any agreement. Because of that, I'm glad you wrote this and glad I read it. As always.
This post was edited by Mr Rice128364 11 months ago
Sadly, all true. Be that as it may, there are times when I drive down a road and see a windmill, I must stop and tilt awhile.
Tilt away, Ham Quixote. There's nothing better than pigs waxing wise.
Sometimes you guys make me feel absolutely dumb. +1
CMC Quote Master and Director of Football Related Discussions
5 Time POTW & 2 Time WPOTW Winner
Two time Poster of The Week, 2011 and 2013.
Ham, awesome stuff, +1 from me, I have followed recruiting for many many years because it was fun to watch some game film and see how that player develops overtime, now with the circus that is recruiting the last few years I am sick of it and honestly it's not fun anymore I'm personally done following it, verbal means nothing and apperently so does the written word, this kid should have to report, if he doesn't then I'm going to my ford dealer to return the POS focus he sold my wife that I signed for...oh wait...the world doesn't work like that and now I'm stuck with it..well such is life, if Eddie was my kid I wouldn't let him change his mind, he would have to keep quiet, try it out for a year and then leave, not going back on your LOI three months after nsd. Whatever, I gotta go to work Go Irish!!!
Don't remember who said it but was something like: "If you don't have your word, than you have nothing at all".
POTW Ham and always +1!
You could have stopped right there. What we see in so many of these "recruits" is systemic in the youth and young adults of today.
No down-vote please - thank you!
No down-vote por favor, gracias !
Gringo Mafia ~
amigo el número cuatro
I am of the opinion that this is a matter between ND and the family. I believe one should keep his word when given but are we even sure ND did that? I am not! I feel I can not really comment on the situation. Though much different it is why I chose to not comment much about Starks. There is way to much unknown. I would agree that if EV just had a change of heart he should honor the contract unless ND releases him. That being said I do not know what transpired and though Ham's sensibilities mirror mine I just can assume I know what is going on. I know he did not as he allowed for unknowns that might change his reaction I think we should keep calm and let the situation unfold and if it becomes apparent what happened then we if we desire we can give our opinions.
It is not Ham's comments that bother me in reality it is the readiness of the board to presume they know exactly what happened. Gentlemen. let us be honest and admit we may never know.I am a father and would expect my son to honor his word and he was taught that but as I said if it was my son I would know what was really going on and not assuming I do.
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by Gulinias 11 months ago
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