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There was a time when I defined a "great" Notre Dame football season by just one requirement: the 11 consensus national titles from 1924 through 1988 (the ones listed below the "Play Like A Champion" sign). To list anything else would water it down.
However, I also thought that seasons like 1948 (9-0-1, No. 2), 1964 (9-1, awarded MacArthur Bowl), 1970 (10-1, upset No. 1 Texas in Cotton Bowl), 1989 (12-1, seven wins over final AP Top 18, including beating No. 1 Colorado in Orange Bowl) and 1993 (11-1, No. 2 and defeated No. 1 Florida State) also should be included either because of a special ending, going unbeaten, a victory over No. 1 in a major bowl, or even sharing a title.
Would you put 2012 in there? On one hand, it was a special rebirth after years of wandering in the wilderness. At the same time, to end it with a 42-14 pasting in the title game leaves an extremely poor memory. It's not like 1964 where the loss in the finale came in the closing minute and with some controversy. 2012 was, in the words of Louis Nix, an "ass-whuppin'." That 28-point loss still resonates so much.
If Brian Kelly does win a national title at ND, the 2012 season probably will get overshadowed. And if he doesn't, then it will be only categorized as his "missed opportunity," much like the 1938 finale when Elmer Layden's No. 1 and 8-0 Irish lost 13-0 to USC.
Any thoughts from our board members.
After so many years of disappointment 2012 will always be a great season to me. If they had won the title it would have been legendary.
Gringo Mafia Director Of Literary Pugilistic Affairs/Davejlewis tried to drink me once/Danny Meyer is my man crush/1 time POTW
The title game loss is what currently reasonates with me. If ND had played Alabama somewhat capably then yes, it would have been a great season. But a complete meltdown seemed to just throw more wood into the fire of ND's critics. ND somehow went 12-0 in the regular season yet lost respect in the eyes of college football. The Te'o saga played into that, but it's pretty remarkable how much the sentiment changed after the 42-14 loss. I think as time passes ND fans will look back on 2012 quite fondly, however.
Given the benchmark at Notre Dame, no, it was not a great season. I believe "great" is reserved for BCS titles only. It was very, very good however.
No down-vote please - thank you!
No down-vote por favor, gracias !
Gringo Mafia ~
amigo el número cuatro
According to ND's Media Guide it will go down as a "super season". We have not had one of those since 1993 when ND went 11-1. A "super season" is anything considered as 1 loss or less. Notre Dame has now had 51 of those seasons since 1887.
Regardless of labels, I believe you have to distinguish between years in
which we were consensus national champions from years in which,
for whatever reason, that didn't occur. There has to be a difference between
"winning it all" ---- i.e. "being at the very pinnacle"----on the one hand
and "almost being at the pinnacle" on the other hand.
Yet, I also feel you can experience a "wonderful, memorable,
even magical" year even though you don't win it all. The years
you mentioned----1948,1964,1970,1989 and 1993 --certainly fit that
category, for the reasons you mentioned as well as because ND was
a national champ in either 1989 or in 1993.
In that sense, I think most of us experienced a "wonderful, memorable,
even magical" season in 2012 even though we didn't win it all and even though
January 7, 2013 remains our own private "day of infamy." I believe it was
Tom Pagna who, in talking about 1964, called it "magical." For many
of the same reasons, I believe 2012 was "magical."
This post was edited by hemy 9 months ago
It's extremely close for me - there certainly were great and memorable games - Stanford, Oklahoma, and Pittsburgh come to mind for me - but the timing and margin of defeat and the final game prevent it from being considered a great season. Maybe it's a distorted way to look at it, but I would remember it as more of a great season had we lost an earlier game (for instance a close loss to Oklahoma) and then closed with a win streak and BCS bowl win.
It was rare and extremely special though, which is why after looking back I hope we don't take that success for granted entering this year.
2 time POTW winner on some dates I can't remember from 2yrs ago at BNG,
POTW: 1/3/11- 1/9/11, 6/20/11-6/26/11
Two time Poster of The Week, 2011 and 2013.
ND has come a long ways since the 2007 season . I was starting to have doubts if ND could get back to where it belongs. 2012 was a great season for ND it had everything last second wins , going on the road as a big underdog and controversy wins. But it proved to everybody ND can compete for championships . Yes Alabama dominated the championship game and were the better team. Its funny to me they say ND didn't belong but Georgia was great and they got blowed out 35-7 in a game.
I would call it great.
Another way to look at it is we did get some national championship recognition according to the Colley Matrix poll. This is a poll used in the BCS calculations. The last season we had any national championship mention was 1993. So it was a great season.
At the time 1993 was a lost season, but in hindsight it was a successful season.
I'm going to wait at least 5 years before I reflect on 2012 in that manner.
It might be a little to early to ask this question, as I'm guessing well over 50% will have a different answer in 5-10 years.
I'll drink to that!
And I agree with you Z.
Absolutely. Yes. It was a "great season"!
What would we call a 12-0 AND BCS NC season - Super Great and for a 12-0 and BCS loss season Great? ND had a super season but GREAT I would rather use that word for an BCS NC season. The loss to Bama showed me that ND, while VERY good, wasn't at Bama's level so I'm not sold that the 2012 team was 'GREAT' but it was pretty dang good. Other word descriptions like 'magical' or 'memorable' certainly apply but, for me, GREAT is about being at the top, the pinnacle - 2012 will always be SPECIAL considering where ND started Sept'2012.
Great season- my definition - "the less I throw across my living room (my ND tumbler filled with Makers during the Stanford game went for a ride) and a minimal amount of cursing at the broadcast".
I have incredibly high standards for this team every year (i don't really know why) since I can recall watching ND with my father around 1988-1989. I don't remember too much back then but the memories of the Davie-Weis era are very fresh. Any time you get into a BCS game it's a great season.
Do you mean BCS Championship Game or just getting into a BCS bowl? If it's the latter, then the 2000 (9-3 with 41-9 loss to Oregon State in the Fiesta), 2005 (9-3 with the 34-20 loss to Ohio State in Fiesta) and 2006 (10-3, with 41-14 loss to LSU in the Sugar) would al be classified as "great."
I agree with IrishMarley in that time might put into better perspective the 2012 campaign. I do prefer the word "memorable" at the present as opposed to great.
Right now I have it one notch below "great," sort of like 1926 (9-1, lost the national title with a 19-0 loss to Carnegie Tech when Rockne was in Chicago for PR work and to scout Navy), 1938 (8-0 ND lost national title on last day of season at USC, 13-0), 1941 (8-0-1 in Leahy's first year for a No. 3 finish), 1952 (No. 3 finish while defeating four major conference champs), 1974 (10-2, end career for Ara with 13-11 win over 11-0 and No. 1 Alabama in Orange Bowl), 1980 (beat Michigan and Alabama, played No. 1 Georgia in Sugar before losing) and 1992 (10-1-1, beat 12-0 Texas A&M in Cotton to finish No. 4).
It was a great book with a terrible ending.
6-Time POTW Winner, 4 time at BGI and 2 at 24/7
Yes. It was a great season. Just like my senior season, 1993, was a great season and so many others where the team fell short and did not win a title but ND maintained its status as an elite and relevant program. National Championships are tough to come by for ND in modern era football, as are 12-0 seasons. We should cherish both.
It was a great season, no analysis required. It's like the Supreme Court justice's comment on pornography. Something along the lines of "I don't know how to define it, but I know it when I see it." In this instance, it just felt great, and that's enough for me.
I may not be pretty, but I'm fast.....
POTW 1/31/11 - 2/6/11
It was a fun season. It's great that Notre Dame didn't lose a handful of games for the first time in a long time. It's great that Notre Dame went 12-0 during the regular season. It's great that Notre Dame was unbeaten at home for the first time since the Davie era.
It was a great routine up until the dismount, which was a complete disaster and the difference between a perfect 10 and a 7 or 8 on the greatness scale.
As you said, Lou, it will either be remembered as a springboard to greatness, or just a flirtation depending on how well the Irish validate last season's run during upcoming seasons under Kelly.
I would call it great.
It is a different CFB world that we live in than that of 1988 or 1993. Like you have mentioned many times before... it Kansas State had won out, we would likely still be celebrating another NC for the Irish. As it is, Alabama was able to use the 6 weeks after the season better than ND was, and that is biggest disappointment to me. I think it would have been a much better game had it been played on New Years Day like years ago.
Member of the Gringo Mafia - chief infiltrator of the federales --- If life hands you lemons, throw them at an UofM fan
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